Enforcement

[Binder]

Has there been any discussion with DNR about what their plans are to step up enforcement at Reiter once it opens again? I think it's clear that there are people out there who just aren't going to follow the rules until they get nailed to the wall. You can educate and teach them all you want but when your back is turned they will screw us all. The only way I see this changing is more enforcement. For that matter the old Reiter would have lasted much longer with better enforcement...
The answer seems clear to me, more cops.....Before you ask no I don't know how to pay them but someone better find a way because it's not going to work the way it's going.
On a related note who knows how much authority a forest watch person would have? Would their eye witness testimony be enough for a LEO to write a citation after the fact? If so I'm buying infra red video equipment and lots of camo.

[jobless]

Has there been any discussion with DNR about what their plans are to step up enforcement at Reiter once it opens again? I think it's clear that there are people out there who just aren't going to follow the rules until they get nailed to the wall. You can educate and teach them all you want but when your back is turned they will screw us all. The only way I see this changing is more enforcement. For that matter the old Reiter would have lasted much longer with better enforcement...
The answer seems clear to me, more cops.....Before you ask no I don't know how to pay them but someone better find a way because it's not going to work the way it's going.
On a related note who knows how much authority a forest watch person would have? Would their eye witness testimony be enough for a LEO to write a citation after the fact? If so I'm buying infra red video equipment and lots of camo.

Judging from what I read about the Forest Watch program you will not be able to write citations, in fact you are not suppose to do anything other than document what is happening, pictures and such and educate where possible.

[The Shocker]

I posted the F.W. handout I got at DNR's training session. They are planning to start the FW program up here soon. As in the Volunteer Coordinator who does the FW training was suppossed to call David today about setting a time to come up and do the training program I went to along with the FW portion that wasn't offered when I went. I plan to keep bugging both David and Christine (Volunteer coordinator) about this program. We need it well before Reiter re-opens. I do know it is a DNR radio that you get so you can call in troubles.

Thanks for bringing this up guys. It really will be what makes or breaks the overall rebuilding plan.

[Binder]

Well I didn't expect a volunteer could write a citation. I also know a LEO can't write a citation without witnessing the act unless it's a fairly serious law broken and expect it to stick. What I'm getting at is if a forest watch person witnesses a act is that binding in that the LEO can write a citation on that volunteers sworn statement? What about with evidence as well as a statement like video evidence?
....If a watch volunteer can do nothing but call the LEO to come see for themselves it isn't worth much if there's no LEO around to come running.

[The Shocker]

Well I didn't expect a volunteer could write a citation. I also know a LEO can't write a citation without witnessing the act unless it's a fairly serious law broken and expect it to stick. What I'm getting at is if a forest watch person witnesses a act is that binding in that the LEO can write a citation on that volunteers sworn statement? What about with evidence as well as a statement like video evidence?
....If a watch volunteer can do nothing but call the LEO to come see for themselves it isn't worth much if there's no LEO around to come running.


The Forest Watch is supposed to radio in to report any illegal activities so the enforcement officer can write the citation. You should be able to provide a sworn affidavit or video/photo evidence to the officer. We will know more hopefully soon.

[crash]

Has there been any discussion with DNR about what their plans are to step up enforcement at Reiter once it opens again? I think it's clear that there are people out there who just aren't going to follow the rules until they get nailed to the wall. You can educate and teach them all you want but when your back is turned they will screw us all. The only way I see this changing is more enforcement. For that matter the old Reiter would have lasted much longer with better enforcement...
The answer seems clear to me, more cops.....Before you ask no I don't know how to pay them but someone better find a way because it's not going to work the way it's going.
On a related note who knows how much authority a forest watch person would have? Would their eye witness testimony be enough for a LEO to write a citation after the fact? If so I'm buying infra red video equipment and lots of camo.

I spoke to Ron about this. He has been up there alot and been writing tickets.

[Binder]

I spoke to Ron about this. He has been up there alot and been writing tickets.

That's a great start but what about in the future? Has this been discussed? I know the DNR doesn't have to answer to us but by us asking it may bring things to their attention or maybe make them think in slightly different ways.....I see this as being the single biggest issue at Reiter.

[crash]

That's a great start but what about in the future? Has this been discussed? I know the DNR doesn't have to answer to us but by us asking it may bring things to their attention or maybe make them think in slightly different ways.....I see this as being the single biggest issue at Reiter.

I can't agree more...

How--I don't know but we should continue to press the DNR on the subject. But like anything its going to boil down to the $$ factor....

Myself I would love to see somebody up there 24/7.....

[Tod701]

Any way to get the county involved with trailhead and road based enforcement?

[crash]

Any way to get the county involved with trailhead and road based enforcement?

They have in the past. There has been I think 2 or 3 grants for this over the years--first being the purchase of 2 bikes. One of the local officers who was out of the gold bar satalite station was trained and rode one of the bikes. If I can catch him I will ask him about it. But I am not sure what they can do on there end as that $$ has to come from way higher up.

[Tod701]

But I am not sure what they can do on there end as that $$ has to come from way higher up.

Maybe folks need to start bugging their county councilmen?

[crash]

Maybe folks need to start bugging their county councilmen?

Never thought of going to the county--hmmmmm

[Binder]

Copied this from the PNW board....

The following is a recent activity report - an update to the Department of Natural Resources request I had received earlier for help on behalf of the association - and in regards to the temporary closure of, violations and vandalism at Reiter Foothills. AB

Between November 9-15 there was a combination of emphasis on patrol; weekly field work; education and enforcement taking place.

As stated, the following is a summary of those activities:

) Fifteen (15) contacts with the public;

) Five (5) citations were issued for motorized vehicle use on closed road/trail - of the five, three were motorized recreationists and two were rock climbers. No other infractions were observed.

DNR staff noted the high degree of compliance with DNR closures and expectations. Thanks were extended to staff who continue to work hard to help ensure better conditions at Reiter, especially in this case the LEO's who traveled from other regions to support this effort. There will continue to be periodic information and enforcement updates.
###
Arlene Brooks, WA. State Director (pnw4wda - c)

[phew]

So whats the story on the fw has anyone been notified of anything ? They sent out the email for voulanteers I as well as a few others I know sent out emails but have got no response. So I guess I'm asking if anyone else got a response

[The Shocker]

So whats the story on the fw has anyone been notified of anything ? They sent out the email for voulanteers I as well as a few others I know sent out emails but have got no response. So I guess I'm asking if anyone else got a response

No, I don't believe they have picked anyone yet for this and there is a training program you need along with the background checks.

I had also emailed David as well as signed up at the DNR meetings for it.

Keep in mind that there may only be a few people used for the program. Tahuya for instance only has 4 from what DNR told me and they preferred to keep it small so it was manageable. I know Reiter needs alot more than that but I don't know how much time David has to devot to the program considering the other tasks he will be dealing with. Hopefuly David picks people from different user groups so everyone has a chance to support the program.

I'm kind of curious as to why we aren't helping patrol Reiter now? It sounds like people are still using the area since DNR can't watch it 24/7. Why don't we try to help with this now before the people who are continuing to use the area force DNR to use all their budget on patrols?

[phew]

Thats kinda what made me post this. Why not let people patrol it so that we don't end up with the same old excusses about it being to hard to control.

[The Shocker]

Thats kinda what made me post this. Why not let people patrol it so that we don't end up with the same old excusses about it being to hard to control.

I have asked DNR Ron about the forest watch and his reply was that we could all report stuff we see up there and that they want our help but just haven't gotten an official Forest Watch started yet.

[98ZJ4X4]

Being the trails are closed, and as I understand it would be to the Trail Watch Volunteers also, could not RTW ask for volunteers to watch the main parking lot and turn off to the upper lot and start patrolling those area now to assist DNR.

I would volunteer to help with that at least a couple days a week or weekend which ever was needed. I would suggest that if this idea is followed up on, you should have at least two people, never a single person alone and they should have working camera's for documentation to give the LEO.

[The Shocker]

Being the trails are closed, and as I understand it would be to the Trail Watch Volunteers also, could not RTW ask for volunteers to watch the main parking lot and turn off to the upper lot and start patrolling those area now to assist DNR.

I would volunteer to help with that at least a couple days a week or weekend which ever was needed. I would suggest that if this idea is followed up on, you should have at least two people, never a single person alone and they should have working camera's for documentation to give the LEO.

The trails are only closed to us driving in. I hiked around today and didn't see anyone else but a few hikers at the lower lot. I did find some more trash that looked fresh.